🚨🚨🚨I released a free training that shares the 4 steps I use to help clients reduce eczema, inflammation, and food-reaction symptoms by 50%+ in a few months — without restriction or overwhelm. The feedback has been incredible, and I answer every question inside the training. Watch here: christabiegler.com/blueprint

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This week on the Less Stressed Life, I’m talking with Elizabeth Wells, also known as Naturally Wells or the Liver Flush Queen. After decades of candida, fatigue, sensitivities, and adrenal burnout, discovering liver flushing in 2016 changed her health. Now she helps clients around the world address chronic gut and liver symptoms that often get overlooked.

KEY TAKEAWAYS:

• Stress lowers stomach acid and slows bile flow
• Sluggish bile drives dysbiosis, SIBO, and recurring gut issues
• Biliary dyskinesia and why gallbladder symptoms often flare postpartum
• Simple bile-supporting tools: bitters, minerals, fiber, nervous-system regulation
• When liver flushing may help—and when it isn’t the right starting point

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ABOUT GUEST:
Elizabeth Wells, known as Naturally Wells or the Liver Flush Queen, is a UK-based nutritionist specializing in liver detox and gut health. After reversing her own chronic Candida, fatigue, and sensitivities through liver flushing, she now coaches clients worldwide on detox and bile-flow support. She’s also trained in EFT and other energy techniques. Elizabeth lives on the Kent coast with her family. 

RESOURCES FROM ELIZABETH, find on her website listed below:
• Free bile-flow guide
• Educational webinars on bile flow + Candida
• 6-week group program for liver detox and flushing

WHERE TO FIND GUEST:
Website: https://www.naturallywells.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/naturallywells/

WHERE TO FIND CHRISTA:
Website: https://www.christabiegler.com/
Instagram: @anti.inflammatory.nutritionist
Podcast Instagram: @lessstressedlife
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@lessstressedlife
Leave a review, submit a questions for the podcast or take one of my quizzes here: ****https://www.christabiegler.com/links

SPONSOR:
🚨Thank you to our friends at Jigsaw Health for being such an incredible sponsor and partner. 😎 If you’re listening during November 2025, use code LESSSTRESSED15 at JigsawHealth.com for 15% off every order. If you’re listening after November 2025, use LESSSTRESSED10 for 10% off anytime.

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TRANSCRIPT:

[00:00:00] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: when we're in a state of stress. Our stomach acid downregulates, then if you are not producing acidic enough food, it's not sending the signal to the gallbladder to produce bile when it gets into the small intestine. And so there's a whole kind of cascade of steps that are dysfunctional.

[00:00:21] Christa Biegler, RD: I'm your host Christa Biegler, and I'm going to guess we have at least one thing in common that we're both in pursuit of a less stressed life. On the show, I'll be interviewing experts and sharing clinical pearls from my years of practice to support high performing health savvy women in pursuit of abundance and a less stressed life.

One of my beliefs is that we always have options for getting the results we want. So let's see what's out there together.

Alright. Today on the Less Stressed Life, I am joined by Elizabeth Wells, who is a nutritionist specializing in liver detoxification and gut health, sometimes better known as naturally wells or the liver flush queen after 35 years living with severe candida infection, chronic fatigue syndrome, multiple chemical sensitivities and electro hypersensitivity.

She discovered liver flushing in 2016 and it completely turned around her health. She now coaches her detox and bile flow protocols to clients all around the world who are dealing with chronic illness, gut infections, and other mysterious complaints, poorly understood by conventional medicine. She's also trained in energy techniques such as EFT, tapping and other modalities to gently support clients' nervous systems as part of a holistic approach.

She lives in the Kent Coast, in the UK with her partner son and dog and in her spare time enjoys going out to raves and getting into nature. Welcome to the show, Elizabeth. 

[00:02:02] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Thank you so much for having me, Krista, I'm very happy to be here. 

[00:02:05] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah, so I was mentioning right before we hit record that ultimately I feel like we're pretty aligned.

I don't know if you go on podcasts very often, but you are trying to draw attention to an area that doesn't really have a lot of attention. There was a guy I believe was a gentleman that used to be the flush guy who has passed away, right? Andreas Maite.

I have his book here, but actually, I'll tell you how this happened. , The other. Practitioner who works in my practice became very interested in liver flushing. It's been a, it's a fringy. I always say, I usually don't have this conversation with people unless they wanna have the conversation, typically.

Because it just it's a whole different ballgame on conversation in general. But let's start with your story first, because I think that's always the most interesting. It's where, you probably didn't really think you wanted to do a gallbladder flush either before you did.

I'm sure every time I think about this I'm like, Ugh, lots of, it's like effort and work, et cetera. So talk to us about your story. So 35 years of having chronic stuff, chronic symptoms of essentially hypersensitivity, which is detoxification burden, right? And definitely poor adrenal function.

And so tell us a little bit about your story, like the symptoms that we're presenting, how they kept recurring, et cetera, et cetera. I wanna hear more about that. 

[00:03:24] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So it's quite hard to pick apart what the root cause was and also, just what I was born with, what I inherited. And lifestyle stuff. Usually when you try and pick everything apart, it's a combination of all of those things. I just was not a very healthy child. I was always ill and I was always having quite sort of inflammatory symptoms, a lot of viruses, hooping, cough that I almost died from when I was about four years old.

And my health was just. Not very good. And I, when I look back, I realize that, probably one of the original instigators was what I inherited from my mom, but also just eating, processed foods in the 1980s and eating a lot of gluten. And looking back, I was definitely gluten intolerant.

And I think, my gut problems started there. And, when the gut gets compromised in, a significant direction from, one variable, then it compromises how it can, it lets the sort of door open, if you like, for other kind of, more pathogenic issues to establish.

So I think that's where it all started. But as I grew up, I was just, as I say, quite sickly. And then, as I reach puberty, a lot of people's health problems often start when they hit puberty. And yeah, I just noticed that a lot of what I would now consider to be fungal overgrowth symptoms started cropping up.

I was always bloated and I had, definite mood symptoms from eating gluten and things like that, and it just progressed and snowballed. My adolescence was very difficult. I had, persistent kind of low mood, I would say very quite severe mood swings. I had a lot of gut problems.

And when I was about 16 or 17 years old, my mum read a book called The Yeast Connection. By a doctor called William Crook. And that was, in the early nineties, no one really knew about candida. No one knew about going gluten-free. But we went on a candida diet, we went gluten-free and yeah, and then I managed with diets and things, but just everything progressively got worse.

I spent about 15 years on China, Chinese herbal medicine, which helped to some degree. But then in my late twenties doing a lot of partying as you do in your twenties. I had a career, I was, had high stress and yeah, I just really hit that kind of stumbling block when I was about 30 years old and I had all the symptoms of what you would consider to be chronic fatigue syndrome, so just persistent burnout, a lot of adrenal symptoms.

Again, just same kind of, yeast overgrowth, symptoms and, I ended up, looking for answers. I went to go and see multiple different doctors both here on the NHS and naturopathic doctors. I did homeopathy, I did lots of different protocols, different herbs.

I did Vedic herbs. I did TCM, traditional Chinese medicine, and I, some, I would get occasional relief. I did a heavy metal cleanse. I did a gut cleanse. I cut out this food. I cut out that food. I spent five years doing a very militant low carb diet for candida relief and got no relief.

[00:06:38] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah, 

[00:06:39] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: and I actually just felt, I suppose almost like. Nothing works for me. I have lots of clients now for whom they say, oh, nothing works for me. Or I, tried everything. And I was definitely one of those people. And I even then joined naturopathic college. And I trained to be a kind of a naturopath nutritionist.

And I remember discussing, or rather the topic of liver and gallbladder flushes coming up during our tuition. And my teacher saying to me, oh, you must never do one of these liver and gallbladder flushes because all that happens is poop out a load of, olive oil and citrus. And it, she just scared me and I thought, oh, I better make sure I never do one of those, you could only go round and round in circles for so long.

And I did loads of my own research by this time in my early thirties. I had. Persistent electrical sensitivity. So I couldn't use a mobile phone. I couldn't use a computer. I had to wear like a head net and stuff to protect me from EMFs. And in those days, nobody really knew anything about that. So I was just, I felt like a bit like a freak.

And I had chemical sensitivities as well. So I was super, sensitive to everything. And yeah, fast forward a few years and somebody on a health forum that I was on said, you can't just keep trying to kill candida. There's a reason that it's there. You have to change the environment.

And it was the first person that someone had said, the first person to ever say that in a way that made me reframe. 'cause I'd always been about, and always understood that you have to try and kill this overgrowth. I'd been doing that, I'd been doing that for, 20 plus years. And so that's where my journey started.

And I got hold of the book by Andreas Maritz and yeah, started to read it and implement it. By that time I was actually in my very early forties and I'd had a child as well. So my kind of toxic load and my whole body was in kind of burnout really. So by the time I actually started doing liver flushing, I was at a very low ebb.

Yeah. And as they say, the rest is history. 

[00:08:53] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. I can resonate with a lot of what you say. I know people listening can resonate with a lot of what you say. So you mentioned several really big pockets of symptoms. I'm curious if you had some other symptoms like white coated tongue or 

Itchiness or scalp itching or any rashes or any dry feet or other things that could be overlapping with even sluggish thyroid as well. Because I find that those two really overlap quite a lot. 

[00:09:17] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Absolutely. They really are. And of course, liver congestion can, be a proxy for, underactive thyroid as well because, so much of the thyroid hormone depends on the conversion by the liver.

And definitely I had all those symptoms and more, I had brain fog. I was trying to do a PhD in my twenties and I was just fueled on like hot chocolate and chocolate from vending machines. And I would just I'd literally just pass out in the library, in the British library. I would just have to go to sleep and stuff.

And I had yeah, terrible brain fog. I had all the itchiness, I had terrible periods I think, which is, having Canada, yeah, having Canada overgrowth makes 

[00:09:59] Christa Biegler, RD: Poor detox function. 

[00:10:00] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And high estrogen and all those estrogen dominance, all those things. And of course when you have an overloaded liver.

Things like, chemical sensitivities, electrical sensitivities, sensitivity to your environment, they all point to an overflowing bucket. But no one really talked about biophysiology. In fact, I often find that, practitioners still don't always talk about biophysiology.

That the kind of, the joining up of all the pieces

is still lacking I think in some areas. 

[00:10:32] Christa Biegler, RD: A hundred percent. And I find just to cut to this part, but then I'll go back is if we overstimulate bile flow, I work with a lot of skin issues. So if we overstimulate bile flow too soon, it's gonna show up on the skin and then everyone freaks out.

Yeah. So we try to do things gently, one thing at a time on purpose, but I resonate with your story a lot as well as someone who had chronic. Fungal stuff for a long time. And I'll phrase this in a way. I remember a client one time said, okay, there's a lot of depth to all these things we can understand and learn, but if you could just boil it down to a couple things, what would you say?

And I would say it feels like the crux or the backbone of what you have really pursued and supported as well. 'cause you do this other nervous system work, so it's really your drainage, detoxification, liver and bile flow system and your adrenal and stress hormone system. Yes. Nervous system are like the major skills that I think will support us all forever.

If you wanna have good health and you learn those skills, those will support you forever. But it's not, there's a lot of nuance to it, which is why we have jobs. Yeah. Why we have jobs. So I wanna ask you a little bit, so similarly, as I track back my history, I don't know if I got some of it from my mother as well.

I'm curious, did your mom have a lot of fungal symptoms also?

[00:11:44] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yes. And still does?

[00:11:46] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. 

[00:11:46] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah. 

[00:11:47] Christa Biegler, RD: And we have this conversation with clients where it's I feel once you realize that mold is just, I like to deescalate the conversation so it doesn't cause more stress.

But I always think mold is very present. It's always been around for thousands of years. We have different building environments, we have all these things, but, and like you said, I think it was, the nineties, no one was really talking about yeast connection or candida. But by 2010, or before and after candida diets were very popular.

All the rage, all this starving. Much like your story, right? I think you said you went on as low carb diet, which I also feel like doesn't work at all. In fact, it just makes things much, much worse. 'Cause you gotta climb outta that hole of now essentially depletion from not, you haven't really solved anything, in my opinion.

Yeah. My real question here that I'm trying to get to is, I feel like we now people know what candida is, but actually we often don't think that mold is there, and I think it's just always there. It's just a little more aggressive and it taxes the adrenals, it taxes the liver, et cetera.

And so do you actually think that maybe there was mold exposure at some time, living in your body giving off endotoxins, et cetera, and congesting the liver and drainage? 

[00:13:00] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: They, it's possible. I did like my childhood bedroom did have damp exposure and that was one of those when you get these houses where you repeatedly try and remediate the mold or the damp again and again, but it always keeps coming back.

So possibly, but I think that. For me, , it's a bit chicken and egg for sure, but where there's mold sensitivity, there's always yeast and a 

[00:13:30] Christa Biegler, RD: hundred percent 

[00:13:31] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: It's difficult to unpick kind of which comes first, but I tend to think it is the dysbiosis. Yeah, the dysbiosis comes first because I've seen it in clients when they've done like a series of liver flushes or whatever, and then there's this stuff cut starts coming out and sometimes they haven't even been diagnosed with any yeast or fungal overgrowth and it's there it is in black and white.

Yeah. 

[00:13:54] Christa Biegler, RD: And I agree with you. I don't think it shows up on testing very well. But I think it hangs out there, and I think we're better off addressing the entire. Dysbiotic patterns, fungus, bacteria, other pathogens, et cetera. I think they're all just hanging out together no matter what. I think they're all riding together and I 

[00:14:12] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: think Symbi.

Yeah, 

[00:14:14] Christa Biegler, RD: and I just think mold is just a more aggressive form of yeast or candida overall. But I bring that up just because sometimes, and I know you, I know, you know what I mean? Sometimes I'm like, oh, am I crazy? I just keep seeing this over and over. I don't feel like I'm crazy. But it's no, I do believe that experience is the best educator.

And so that's what you do. It's this is what was really helpful. I lead people through this thing. You get to see the results on the other side, and when you help those people, it's fine. It's, you get to see those results. So let's talk about these. Let's talk about some of the concepts of flushes or why they might be needed in the first place.

So we could talk about, that we live in this toxic. Environment. It just is what it is. But more specifically, and it may have always been this way, why do you think there's so much congestion with gallstones? Why do you think? Because anyone who's ever done a flush that I know passes hundreds of gallstones.

Yeah. And because some people there's stereotypes that might come up for people. Oh, I don't have gallstones, i'm like how could you possibly know if you don't have gallstones? Yeah. So what would you say about this, and why is it commonplace for us to have gallstones?

[00:15:20] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So I think it's become more common, so I dunno about you, but I've just see anecdotally, younger and younger people seeming to need their, gallbladder removed or having gallbladder attacks or, biliary dyskinesia or cholestasis and for me, it really is about the gut liver axis.

So it's what have you inherited and what have you then accumulated through your life? And because dysbiosis produces so many toxins, and we are seeing a progressively generationally depleted population with poorer and poorer microbiome function, that's where it, in my opinion, that's where it starts.

So we inherit our microbiome mostly from the mother. We are now seeing, 60, 70, 60 plus years of routine antibiotic use during delivery obstetric, procedures, which we didn't really have before. And so as soon as you change that gut environment it's going to have a knock on effect.

And, the microbiome keeps the gut all, it maintains all the tight junctions in the gut, right? So as soon as you get damaged there, you get this translocation of bacterial and fungal metabolites, and then you get proteins, food proteins, and other proteins escaping. So I think there's an epidemic of leaky gut, and I think that's where it's starting.

So the liver has to act like a satellite gut because whatever is inflaming the gut and causing this recirculation of toxicity is being shuttled back through the entero hepatic portal or the circulation back to the liver and the liver. Essentially gets overwhelmed. And then if you add onto that all the trappings of modern society and modern diets, and if you add onto that, what we are breathing in every day, and if you add onto that, the levels of stress that we're seeing in modern society and the disconnection for humans.

And then of course, there's a whole long la laundry list that we can go into. But just, just things like not living to our circadian rhythm a lot just generations of people now with some metabolic damage or a depressed metabolism, like a, a slower metabolism.

And so everything slows down. Things don't pass through the gut as quickly as they should. They ferment, then they stay around for longer and that invites more pathogenic, organisms in. So it is a real, snowball effect. And for me it definitely comes down to what is this person inheriting and then what are they subject to as they go through their life.

So yeah, that's a. That's a kind of multilayered answer, but 

[00:18:27] Christa Biegler, RD: that's okay. No problem. I will highlight and underline. I think you do have to address what's going on with the gut and the liver at the same time. I've never had anyone say, think of the liver is a satellite gut, right?

It's taking on, there's all this circulation happening and I wanna mention, and you're welcome to correct me. I don't think we have good testing. I think, there's a stereotype that is, the answer is in the test and I don't think we have good concise testing around liver gallbladder function.

I think symptoms point more to it personally. I don't know if you have any comment to that. There are some inferences we can get in testing. But I find that even when you say people having gallbladder attacks, et cetera, like at that point it's really significant. Before it's gonna show up on any testing.

So if your liver enzymes are often blood work, something really significant is going on by that time, whereas there's money, there's a lot of opportunity long before that. 

[00:19:17] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah. And I think maybe just, practitioners or kind of allopathic physicians don't necessarily know what they're looking at.

Yeah. And they're not picking it up and it's being misdiagnosed di as IBS or colic, for example. 

[00:19:31] Christa Biegler, RD: Totally. I wanna ask you a little bit about some of these other side effects we don't always think of as gallbladder. I'm gonna ask you about biliary dyskinesia in a moment.

But first since you brought up stress, I think, can you point to exactly how stress impacts gallbladder function? 

[00:19:46] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So I think it just, the kind of dominant way I would look at it is it just provides a contraction of the whole digestive apparatus, if you like. So it's, from the point at which you are putting food into your mouth and that passage that it takes to the stomach.

And, when we're in a state of stress. Our stomach acid downregulates, then if you are not producing acidic enough food, it's not sending the signal to the gallbladder to produce bile when it gets into the small intestine. And so there's a whole kind of cascade of steps that are dysfunctional.

And I think that's really where it's happening is that's just, that whole orchestra, if you like, digestion is like an orchestra and if one element is missing and, , just all the hormones. Go wrong, gastrin and secreting and CCK, they just don't work as they should.

And then you're just left with this bolus of food that's just not being acidified and then not being neutralized. And then what's happening further down in the gut is then you're getting this SIBO type situation because essentially something has to break that food down. And if it's not going to be your own, secretions or digestive secretions, it's going to be something else.

[00:21:05] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. Let's actually back it up and talk about the function and the benefit of bile. Why should we care so much about bile flow? What are some of the benefits of what it's doing in the body? 

[00:21:13] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Bile is like a kind of a multifactorial sort of detergent that you know has multiple benefits in the body.

So it, it helps you break down your dietary fats. It helps you absorb your fat soluble vitamins like a DEK, et cetera. It's, your primary toxin kind of elimination factory. It's gonna bind excess toxins and bilirubin and estrogen, and it's going to pass it down to the stool to be eliminated.

This is really important. It's strongly anti-microbial, so it helps to prevent microorganisms, your stomach acid and your, your bi your pancreatic juices and your bile are so important for neutralizing each other. And also just closing the door so that pathogens do not get a foothold and can start colonizing in your intestines.

It is an important pH regulator, so it's going to help neutralize that acidic chime that comes through from the stomach, because that's really important. Because it needs to protect the, the mucosa, the lining of the gut. If the pH is not. Correct. So yeah, our digestive system has different pH or acid alkaline balance throughout the whole thing.

And it, it changes depending on where, what part of the intestine you are talking about. But pH is really important because if your pH is off, so for example, if your acidic, if your food you that's very acidic is not being neutralized and by pancreatic, enzymes and bicarbonate and biliary juice, then you are not going to get enough the right pH in the small intestine and the large intestine.

And again, that's really important for allowing the right microbes to flourish. Your friendly microbes, your lactobacillus, your bifidobacteria, they like a slightly acidic environment. And they also produce metabolites called short chain fatty acids, and they help to make, the colon acidic.

And. All those stages are really important for maintaining, for allowing the conditions for the right microbes to grow. Yeah. So if you don't have the right pH, the wrong microbes are going to step in and colonize that. And it's also really important to say that bile is also yeah. It lubricates, it hydrates, it soothes the intestinal tract.

If you've got inflammation there, that's very likely to be, to do with the downregulation or the poor production of bile. And it helps you go to the toilet. 

[00:23:51] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. I would say some things that you just said, you were talking about earlier. That we have an epidemic of dysbiosis or poor microbial terrain, et cetera, and right there you get the answer of why this is recurrent Stress will deplete stomach acid.

That's one mechanism. It's the first thing that checks out, right? It's going to, if we're downregulating, if the liver or drainage function is congested or a bile is not able to be made. Freely, et cetera. It's overall congested. You're gonna have issues with controlling microbe overgrowth and so you're gonna have a recurrence of that.

So I just wanna underline that. And then, aside from learning the skills of drainage detoxification and adrenal and stress hormone function, the other one would be optimizing digestion. If we had a three, three-pronged stool, because this is a, it is a big one, and I always joke, you can just put on my tombstone that no one was digesting.

All right. So let's talk about this word that you mentioned, this term that you mentioned earlier, biliary dyskinesia. I wanna hear about what this is and how it may produce some symptoms that we may not always attribute to bile function. 

[00:24:58] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So benary dyskinesia is like what I would consider to be just poor gallbladder function and gallbladder release.

Sometimes it can be as a result of what they call poor ejection fraction. So it's just not releasing as much bile as it should. It may be inflamed, it may be slightly fibrotic. That's more like a kind of late stage, kind of situation, but it's very common. And often there is, it's to do with the bile itself being very sludgy and slow.

Sometimes there may be stones there or there may be yes sludge less common parasites, but sometimes that can be part of the picture as well. If somebody's been in a lot of stress for a long time and they have elevated cortisol, then that really messes up the gallbladder picture because it can cause this estrogen dominance and progesterone is very sensitive to cortisol.

So if you've been running on stress hormones for a long time, it can affect your progesterone. And when progesterone is insufficient that can also affect the motility of the gallbladder and estrogen dominance as well. Makes school makes. Bile very thick and sludgy. So it's a kind of, yeah, it's a complex of different things, but usually there needs to be, a kind of focus on helping the bile itself to be thinner and also just helping all the different stages of digestion, like we've talked about and working on someone's stress and just helping to thin the bile and, work on gut motility as well.

Because of course, if your gut is sluggish and you're not going to the toilet every day, that's going to increase the burden on your liver and gallbladder. 

[00:26:49] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. Did you mention that bloating would be a common symptom of this? And I find that this is gonna be one of those ones where the bloating is not necessarily going to resolve with maybe some other interventions, and it could be a very sneaky downstream cause of chronic bloating that quote unquote.

Yes. Cannot be found for a reason. Yeah.

[00:27:10] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: And like you said we, and like we were both saying before, it's just, it's, then there's gonna be more than one stage affected because the gallbladder's always going to, to down-regulate bowel production if the stomach is not producing enough stomach acid, because essentially it's like a safety, it's like a feedback loop.

If the b if the gallbladder senses that there's not going to be enough bile to, neutralize the acidic food, then it's gonna dial that down. So I find that when clients work on both stomach acid and bile function, and they maybe do a few liver flushes suddenly when bile is working better, suddenly their stomach acid is working better as well.

There's a, there's definitely a reciprocal relationship there. Usually in the literature you'll find the relationship goes one way, but I think there's also a feedback loop that maybe. We're yet to discover seriously doing liver flushing has taught me more about the digestive system than anything I've ever read.

Because you realize that there are loads of feedback loops in the body that you didn't even realize what to do with the liver. 

[00:28:24] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. I think that's the reality of working with humans as well. Yeah. You learn more than you could ever read in literature. Yeah. It's I see that happening like this.

[00:28:31] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:28:31] Christa Biegler, RD: It reminds me of going to a microbiome conference and sitting in a round table and having a discussion. I'm like, I know prebiotics are only supposed to feed the good bacteria, but that is not what I see in practice. They're like, 

[00:28:41] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: oh, tell 

[00:28:41] Christa Biegler, RD: me about that. Neither. They're like, 

[00:28:44] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: I would be like, I'd be yep, me too.

[00:28:46] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. Not how it actually looks in real life. Okay. So I still have a ton more questions. So real quick, I think the natural next thing is let's talk about some simple things for improving bile flow. Just a, quick handful. 

[00:28:59] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah. 

[00:28:59] Christa Biegler, RD: Things.

So a while back, my college age daughter shared with me that she was tossing and turning and waking up several times per night after a period of stress. We started her on magnesium and her sleep immediately improved. I personally think magnesium should be your first thing to try if you're having trouble sleeping or staying asleep, especially tossing and turning, and it's a no brainer if you have any restless leg issues.

The thing about magnesium at that is that there's a lot of types of magnesium that will give you symptomatic relief, but I like to steer my clients and loved ones to a more absorbable form of magnesium because most big box magnesium is mag citrate, and that will push bowels, but it can be damaging to your teeth if it's used daily and it's not the most absorbable.

Rather, jigsaw Health makes one of my favorite great tasting magnesium powders called Mag. So that has magnesium glycinate, my favorite calming and absorbable type of magnesium. It's available in both a great tasting powder and to-go packets. And they also make a product, that's great for slow release, especially if you have restless legs called Meg, SRT.

So if you are not falling asleep easily, or if you have disrupted sleep, you can try at least 200 milligrams of. Great magnesium like Mag Soothe or mag, SRT, especially if you have restless likes, it works better to take this at least 20 minutes before you go to bed to allow it to kick in. And you can get a discount on all of jigsaw's amazing products, including Mag Soothe at Jigsaw Health with a code less stress, 10.

Now you can use. Less stressed, 10 as many times as you want with every order at Jigsaw Health, which is honestly pretty unheard of with coupon codes. So enjoy the magnesium from jigsaw with my code less stressed, 10.

 

[00:30:49] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So the first thing I think they eat the low hanging fruit as they say, would be to just really try and clean up someone's diet a bit, really.

So if somebody is eating a lot of refined foods, particularly refined white flour, refined sugar, fried foods, a lot of caffeine or alcohol, those would be like the five or six kind of big low hanging fruit that I would just say, okay, you really need to dial that down. Liver really doesn't like fried things.

And if you're gonna use oils or fats and you need to use cold pressed and, use them afterwards or pour them on your food after you've cooked them, steaming things, baking things is usually better than frying. Yeah, and just those foods that kind of cause congestion, as I say, those refined or ultra processed foods.

I'd always look at someone's intake of soluble fiber. And of course that's really, it's really down to the individual and is dependent on the context because not everybody can jump in and use soluble fiber, especially if they have a situation that's like SIBO for example, or a lot of fermentation there.

But, usually you can try and train that muscle a little bit. You just start off really small. Sometimes people make the mistake of thinking I need to eat more fiber, and then they go in, need a lot of fiber and then wonder why they're like looking nine months pregnant. So 

[00:32:12] Christa Biegler, RD: yeah, 

[00:32:13] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: literally start to just, try and introduce things in a really.

Small in a measured way. Something like, as I say, soluble fiber pectin is really good. So apples can be really helpful in that situation. You want to use soluble fiber because soluble fiber acts like this amazing sponge and or a brush. It brushes and cleans the walls of the intestines.

And it absorbs bile soluble toxins and then they get carried out with the stool rather than sent back to the liver for, further processing. And then we look at things like bitter foods, bitter drinks, bitter teas and obviously you've got all your sort of liver friendly supplements that you can take.

Maleic acid foods rich in maleic acid are also very helpful. 

[00:32:59] Christa Biegler, RD: And not to mention correcting the dysbiosis, which will impede that bile flow, et cetera.

[00:33:05] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yes. Which. Stress and managing stress. 

[00:33:07] Christa Biegler, RD: Yes. Huge one. Okay. So a lot of gallbladder issues pop up postpartum. Women right after pregnancy start to have gallbladder attacks.

Why is that? 

[00:33:18] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: just the changes that happen, during pregnancy, the fluctuating levels of hormones and usually the thyroid is involved in some way, sometimes after birth the thyroid can become hyper and then it can. Have become hypo. So there's a lot of fluctuations that happen.

And essentially, during pregnancy you've got a baby kind of packed into a really tight space. It does tend to squash the gallbladder and the liver. And so it's quite hard if you've already got an existing, either dysbiosis or existing liver congestion problem, then you're going to see that flaring up exacerbating in pregnancy.

Yeah. And then after pregnancy, it's very common. 

[00:34:02] Christa Biegler, RD: I wanna mention, I would just wanna give definition to something because we often, you often can read or people say hormones fluctuating. And what I think we wanna remember when we say hormones fluctuating is when something goes up, it must come down.

And when it goes down, what's gonna happen, it's gonna need to use those processes of detoxification and drainage. So if that system in general is under stress 'cause it doesn't have enough workers. If it's just generally congested, then you could have more exacerbation of issues. Yes. And so I like to, I don't think, we always think, often we say hormone fluctuation and I only, it has nothing to do with you.

But I wanted to say, oh yeah, that's what that means. When it's going up, it's gotta come back down. That's what fluctuating, 

[00:34:41] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: yeah, no 

[00:34:41] Christa Biegler, RD: it's gotta go through systems. 

[00:34:42] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: It's a good point. It's going to, it's going to contribute to the log jam. 

[00:34:46] Christa Biegler, RD: Exactly. That's 

[00:34:46] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: an existing log jam. It's like sometimes you have a, you don't know that you have a problem in a certain area until there's like this final stressor or trigger that takes over and then all of a sudden it flags up 

[00:34:59] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah.

What 

[00:34:59] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: was already there. 

[00:35:00] Christa Biegler, RD: That's why I work with skin stuff. Not because I thought, oh, I would love to work with skin stuff, but people just kept coming for that and I have a history of it, and so I understood it intimately and it moves us to action more than the other symptoms. It once it becomes, visible, it really moves us to action. So I'd rather help people have vibrant energy, but whatever,

[00:35:21] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: it told you, you were 

[00:35:22] Christa Biegler, RD: called, it's all the same. It's all the same stuff and it's good. It's all good, but it's, similar. It's not much different than what we're discussing.

It's all completely related. Okay. So more questions about. Flush, some flush nuance specific things. But the thing that comes up all the time is and let me reference the physiology. Bile is made in the liver, it is stored in the gallbladder. You've gotta have this duct working well, et cetera.

But what if you don't have a gallbladder game over for gallbladder flushing? 

[00:35:56] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: It is not game over for gallbladder flushing. My experience is it's a little bit more unreliable. 

Yeah, people do it. And sometimes they get good results, but I've also seen people get yeah.

Patchy or inconsistent results. So it's not something that I personally coach, because essentially you've got nothing to concentrate the bile. 

[00:36:20] Christa Biegler, RD: And 

[00:36:21] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: so you don't have anything to do that push. But I know other practitioners who do coach, people who want to do liver flushing just without, a gallbladder.

So it can be done. If you can't do it or you don't want to do it, then you are really looking at, persistent long-term lifestyle changes and, just being very careful with diet and doing all those, dietary modifications as a lifestyle going forward.

[00:36:48] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. Yeah. I think it's tough. I think it's a tough scenario. I find that when we don't have a gallbladder, sometimes it's like, Ooh, I think you would really benefit from this. But it's not, I don't coach on that either. In fact, again, I don't even bring this up unless someone brings it up to me.

Just because it is takes, it takes a level of commitment. I would say overall 

[00:37:09] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: yeah. and it's always worth saying, there are, some people do respond very positively to supplementation. For some of those people, taking tka or, ox Bar or something like that is going to be enough in concert with, lifestyle modifications and things like that.

It's just, yeah, it's not gonna be quick. 

[00:37:27] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah I'm often reminded I wanna talk a little bit about the absolute most negative side of flushing, just so we're, because I think education is really important and I always want things to go as successfully as possible. And so I had this practitioner that came to work with me after this happened, but she got really into doing flushes, but maybe wasn't whatever.

She was living in a very moldy environment and she ended up having a gallbladder attack and going and having her gallbladder removed and she was doing it a little too frequently. Anything you wanna say as a disclaimer around doing things right? That's why you do coaching, but I I like to have worst case scenario.

I like to put it out front because I don't want people to do this willynilly, or without good effort, without doing it properly. It's important to me anyway. 

[00:38:09] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So I would maybe see what happened to that practitioner slightly differently, which is that and here's where I might be a bit different from most.

Most practitioners who do detox or liver flushes, is that the process of clearing the liver actually takes years. 

It's not quick. 

[00:38:28] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. 

[00:38:28] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: And so what may have happened is that this person, I don't know, I'm just, she was doing 

[00:38:33] Christa Biegler, RD: many of them rapidly For sure. 

[00:38:34] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah.

Speculating that can be tricky. So I have done many, I've done nearly 400 and there are issues, if you do them too close together, you will dilute and deplete your bile. And bile is nutritional fluid. It responds to your nutrition and you do need to be careful not to do, them two close together.

Having said that, I spent many years doing at least one a week. 

And if you look after your nutrition, if make sure you replenish your minerals. If you take choline, if you know what to do, you can do that safely. That's sort another perspective is that sometimes people think that the flush itself isn't working or they've done something wrong.

But actually what's happened is the liver is just unpacking. And it takes a long time to unpack essentially many feet of tiny ducts. And these ducts have got lots of material in them. And of course the liver also then cleans the rest of the body and it cleans the blood. And once it's, unpacked some of its major congestion, the liver can do its job better of cleaning the blood and then it's gonna filter the blood, and then it's gonna clean it, and then it's going to encapsulate those toxins.

[00:39:55] Christa Biegler, RD: So 

[00:39:55] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: that's why it takes a longer time than people think. And sometimes if people do one and then they stop 'cause they think, oh, I've done the books is to do 12, I've done 12. And they stop and then they, two, three months down the line, they've got horrible gut symptoms or they're having gallbladder attacks and they don't know why.

That's the reason is because the liver doesn't know about an arbitrary. Time limit where you say, okay, I'm gonna do 12 and then I'm gonna stop. The liver doesn't understand that. Yeah. Whatever is doing what you've asked it to do, you've invited it to start unpacking and that's what it's going to do. So it's bile is not a stagnant material.

It's not a static organ. It's constantly in flux. So it will carry on doing that job for you and you have to know how to manage it. So the other part of your question was caveats around it. Yes, there are caveats around it. So if you have any kind of gallbladder stent, for example I wouldn't flush if you have any kind of obstruct intestinal obstructions or adhesions.

I'd be very wary of doing it. You can't do it if you are breastfeeding a newborn baby or a very young baby. You can't do it when you're pregnant. You can't do it if you are on a very restricted. Diet or far, if you're doing a lot of fasting, it's not recommended because it is also a procedure that can be quite, intense on the body.

There are a couple of other ones some inflammatory bowel diseases like Crohn's and ulcerative colitis is not recommended. So there are a few kind of contraindications and if you are going into it and you want to do it by yourself, I would say my best advice would be to read the book by Andreas Moritz and don't try and skip any of the stages of prep.

And if you're hesitant to do it by yourself, then seek out a practitioner to guide you through it. 

[00:41:53] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. The normal recommendation, I think, maybe from him is to do it once a month until you're not seeing gallstones anymore. Is that correct? But you say you just continue. 

[00:42:06] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: It's unlikely that you're ever gonna be at a stage where you're not gonna see gallstones ever because the body is always cleaning.

The liver will always be cleaning house. There may be periods where there's a lot of space between gallstones, right? So you, when you free up the liver, there's less congestion there. You may be doing a few flushes where you don't see much. That doesn't necessarily mean there aren't any stones left.

It just means that you are pushing and pushing what's further back towards the liver. So I would say it's a really long process and unfortunately. It's only when you get to the sort of stages that I'm at with it that you realize that because you don't get any of that information from any books that you read.

[00:42:50] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah, of course there would be no way to know without 

[00:42:52] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: no someone going through those 

[00:42:53] Christa Biegler, RD: experiences. Yeah, 

[00:42:54] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Sometimes I feel like someone who's landed on the moon because there's only very few people I know who have done what I've done, and I've learned so much about the body and of what I've really learned, and I must just stress this.

Is that the liver is such a central organizer of everything in the body. Like everything. And when you do liver flushing, you realize that everything from your mood to even how you think about the past, even how you think about, how the direction that your life has taken, like you can either see it as something that, you know my life has been one particular way, but when you start flushing, you realize that, wow, all these things I thought were my personality actually just their result of congestion.

Like my personality has changed so many times, or just aspects of my personality have changed because I've cleaned my liver out. It's crazy. 

[00:43:54] Christa Biegler, RD: I know. I love that story. Actually. That is how the other practitioner in my practice got so interested in flushing was hearing people have stories about anxiety and she had a big.

Not completely known toxic burden exposure last year that triggered a lot of essentially anxiety, really aggressive anxiety. And so after her first flush, she's oh, the world is clearer. I like see it. It is like beautiful. And I love that because, we work with a lot of skin stuff and so it's okay, that makes sense.

But sometimes we don't think that these things would be so related. And so it's seen as believing in real life, right? It's like trying to tell someone at the very beginning of something, or assure them when they have barely started. It's wait till you get to the other side.

Yeah. And then we'll chat about it, okay. I do have a few more questions. So when flushing, do you think it's common to see fungus or what looks like fungus in the stool at the same time? So this white material? 

[00:44:43] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yes, absolutely. And that's what has been so much of a revelation for my practice really, is just seeing people get rid of what is obviously.

A major contributory factor to their symptoms without necessarily even realizing it. So sometimes in the early stages you can sometimes release it if you do an enema. So if you do an enema or coffee enema, or you do a moid plaque cleanse, sometimes you see that stuff.

And that's in the, that's usually candida in the colon and it can look cloudy, stringy, that kind of stuff. When you get further up, and this is consistent with what they say in the literature, is that it becomes more of a, an aggressive fungal form. 

So what in the colon tends to be more like the yeast form, and when you get further up in the guard, it becomes more like this cotton fiber, this kind of matrix of material.

It looks very different. It looks like. Yeah. It looks like little webbing. And actually, if you look at candida or candida under a microscope, it looks exactly like what comes out after flushes. And I have. Basically that's how I got over my Candida infection. I've just seen buckets and buckets of this stuff, which is what made me realize how a lot of kind of antifungal strategies are just not gonna work for some people because if they're carrying that level of burden like I was it's incredible how much of that stuff I have released over the years.

Yeah, it just goes to show wow, there are people walking around with this stuff and when they release it, they release or they resolve some of these symptoms that they've been living with all their life. 

[00:46:22] Christa Biegler, RD: I'm sure that after your first flush, there was some positive things, otherwise you wouldn't have continued overall.

But that makes me think about, do you feel like it took a certain point where you were like, wow, these fungal symptoms are really starting to clear up.

[00:46:37] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: It was a lot longer than you'd think. 

Which is why I'm an advocate for I've rethought about the whole process, right?

So I didn't start releasing any kind of fungal material until around flush 88 so if you think about, I felt better, don't get me wrong. I had lots of other gains. I gained energy. I, my brain fog was better, my adrenals functioned better. I was sleeping better, I was more patient, et cetera, et cetera.

But that stuff didn't start coming out until quite until two years into my journey. 

[00:47:07] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah, I think that's really important to share because I am 10 years into journey and generally live without symptoms most of the time. But, sometimes things pop it's easy to, I'm like, I know I have colonies of fungus inside of me.

Like I've got plenty of evidence. I've just been controlling them for a long time.

[00:47:26] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: And also, it's important to say not everyone needs to do what I've done, yeah. It's definitely not for everybody. And, if I was advising somebody who was like, I just don't wanna do liver flushing, I'd be like, okay, that's fine.

Work on your bowel flow. Work on your gut health. And you know what, most importantly, and I've come to this realization a bit later, really, is really work on your nervous system health. Really work on your stress levels and do pick just some kind of, meditation or tapping, which is what I do, or something like that.

It makes such a huge difference. 

[00:48:01] Christa Biegler, RD: Such a difference. And actually this brings me to this next question about stomach acid and hydrochloric acid. Because this was literally a revelation I had in practice. I used to do a lot of petain HCL type supplementation for low stomach acid at the right juncture, and it would help.

And then people would go backwards because stress depletes or suppresses stomach acid first. And so what's really happening, of course, is stress will deplete minerals and those are co-factors for even making the stomach acid. So then I just went farther downstream to the minerals. I've been much happier around it just because it's this whole, it really brings us back to this is the root of the root instead of trying to force it with a replacement.

It will you get improved symptoms from the replacement, but you've gotta really deal with stress at the root of the root, which is, this mineral function, et cetera. And i'm curious. One of the things I learned from my naturopathic mentor years ago was that taking hydrochloric acid as a supplement too soon when there's certain pathogens, especially here, l backer pylori will drive it deeper into the tissue.

So I'm curious about your opinion about using stomach acid depletion, if you always use it, if you use bitters. If you go mineral, because I appreciate, and the reason I'm tying this together is because you mentioned something earlier that I think was important. You were doing a lot of flushing, but you were attending to taking in good nutrition.

Repleting minerals. And by the way, the entire point of you maybe even saying about your nervous system is like your minerals will not be okay when your nervous system is dysregulated and trying to help land that for myself and for clients has been an incredible journey. If you're not happy, if you're frustrated with your kids or your marriage or where you live or all of these things, like all of that is going to be reflected in your physiological health.

Sorry. It is. Yeah. I've dealt with all of it. 

[00:49:47] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yeah. And it's really difficult because, my personal sort of situation is I live with chronic stress. I have a son with, complex kind of behavioral needs. And so I live in a high stress environment, and I'm always gonna live in a high stress environment.

And sometimes there's not that much you can do about it. However. Sure what you can do is try and deal with your response and try and deal with as much as you can do to just work on yourself. But yeah, absolutely. I would always say nutrition comes first and just to be really, 'cause a lot of people when they, you delve into their stomach acid issues have got, adrenal fatigue or thyroid downregulation, or they're just at a low kind of metabolic air and they're not holding onto those minerals.

Food always comes first, but, minerals are a close second. And 

[00:50:34] Christa Biegler, RD: yeah, 

[00:50:35] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: electrolytes and I'm always buying it into my clients like, you need coconut water if you're gonna flush, because you're, the first thing that gets knocked off by flushing is potassium usually. Yeah.

Yeah. 

[00:50:46] Christa Biegler, RD: Super important. Couple more things and then we'll wrap up. About the fungus releasing in the stool, did you have any opinion or experience where priming for this improved it? So doing anything with antifungals, et cetera in advance? 

[00:51:02] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Yes. For some clients, and I include my own experience in that they get a certain, make a certain headway with liver flushing and then they, it stops and they can't get the stones to release.

And I didn't realize what was causing that for a really long time. And it's, there seems to be a pattern. By which those clients who have all the symptoms of fungal overgrowth or dysbiosis have significant biofilms in their liver ducts. Obviously, we know that it can colonize the whole of the intestines, but it can also colonize the liver ducts.

And so sometimes if that's the case, you are flushing, but nothing's coming out. And in those situations, that's when you need to potentially bring in some kind of antifungal or antimicrobial in a sort of fairly controlled short period in order to try and just loosen that biofilm. And usually if you do that for, a while, a short while, and then you flush usually, then it's more successful.

[00:52:13] Christa Biegler, RD: And I'll mention, sometimes there's aggressive things you can do to break open or permeate biofilms and they can make you feel like garbage, which is why we have jobs as well. Because if it was just all really simple and easy. Yeah. I wish it was honestly.

Yeah, totally. But it's, there's like a little push and pull here and it's yeah, that could happen or this could happen or whatnot, and actually I think about the other clinician in my practice, she we're pretty opposite. I'm pretty aggressive and she's really conservative and it's a beautiful symbiotic relationship in that way.

And she'll very often, proactive. She was so proactive in helping people be on charcoal or binders, and I was so annoyed at how well, that worked. But the reason I bring it up is because when you are binding, circulating toxins, that's a pretty damn good sign that you got some stuff you need to push out and clear, et cetera.

Yes. That there's automatically toxins circulating, just going back to that entire toxic environment. Okay. Last thing, just because it's so fun. I really value getting to talk to someone who works in with real people, right? Because when you work in practice, I just feel like you'd learn a lot from humans, as we already mentioned.

But your story started as a child and and I work with kids and I would never be doing gallbladder flushes with kids. But what would you maybe say, and you just brought up some things that you have in your own stresses as a mother as well, and so people might ask themselves like, oh, is there a minimum age for flushing in general?

[00:53:34] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: It's interesting. Andre says that kids can do it from the age of 10. And I have had contacts, so I don't coach kids to do these, but I have been in touch with or heard from people to, and said, yes I do it on my child of 12 or whatever. And I'm like, okay, if you want to do that, my feeling is and my son did do one, but there's no good just doing one.

And the thing is, with a child, they need to understand what they're doing because if you just force compliance on a child and say this is what you're gonna do, and it's not, it can be quite a stressful kind of procedure. If you're an adult, you can understand it and consent to it and understand why you're doing it for your future self, but a child doesn't really live in the future.

And so I would say. Please try and wait until your child can either understand and really fully consent, or they're old enough to say I've got these health issues and I would like to do this myself. Yeah. So I'm hoping my son will want to do another one eventually. 

[00:54:37] Christa Biegler, RD: Yeah. 

[00:54:37] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: But I think I introduced it too soon and now he's I'm never wanted to enough.

[00:54:42] Christa Biegler, RD: In your defense, between the age of five and 25, they have their own mind of their own. And so there's no real pushing or prodding or whatever. Exactly. And what I wanna add onto what you're saying, everything you're saying is beautiful. Never do something to your child that you wouldn't do to yourself as well.

Make sure you're the expert on something before no matter what. And that should be obvious, but sometimes, like if our kid is dealing with something, we just wanna help them not have pain, help them not deal with it. And it's yeah, if you don't have experience, but I find that this, as someone who works with kids, you're mostly working with the mom's nervous system and it's a real treat.

If you now have two clients and it's okay, it's fine, but it's like there's a lot of worry, right? Because it's not their body, et cetera. And it's I don't do risky things with kids whatsoever. It's almost boring because it's so unrisky and that's okay, right? Yeah. But the issue is, has nothing to do with the protocol or whatever, or whatnot.

It really has to do with the parent is, it's uncomfortable. It's uncomfortable. It's literally they're sitting in discomfort watching their child go through something uncomfortable. And that's what it boils down to, is we hate freaking discomfort as humans. Yeah. Yes. And yeah, so just, I like to acknowledge, I like to sit and think about these things as I'm eating lunch.

And then this is what this prob person's problem is today. Let me have some empathy around that. It's okay. It's all fine. So Elizabeth, it's been such a treat to talk to you. We didn't even hardly get into, flushing, but I wanted to go over like the big more interesting stuff. 'cause people can go learn about flushing.

There's all these different directions. I've got all of these haphazard directions. It's quite hilarious from all these different sources and it's an interesting journey. Nevertheless. And something I haven't gotten to yet, because you gotta do so many before you get there, is you actually have created your own miniature protocol that you recommend.

Not until people get a little bit farther along. That's right. So glad you have because I am excited about doing a miniature protocol instead of a full Yeah, 

[00:56:31] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: it's really in 

[00:56:31] Christa Biegler, RD: your 

[00:56:31] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: future mean it's really effective. It's great. I just, for people who've got a lot of gallbladder sludge or they're having a lot of kind of symptoms, so they've got like upper right quadrant pain stuff, I'm like okay. Don't do the mini. But for people who've done like a few of the full ones, it's a really good protocol and it gets good results. 

[00:56:48] Christa Biegler, RD: Awesome. Where can people find you online? 

[00:56:51] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: So I have a website naturally wells.com. Other than that, I have my Instagram, which is at naturally Wells and handily enough, my YouTube, which is also at Naturally Wells.

[00:57:04] Christa Biegler, RD: So convenient. Perfect. Yeah. Thank you so much for coming on today. I really appreciate you sharing your wisdom and experience with us. 

[00:57:10] Elizabeth Wells, D.N.N.: Thank you so much.